Bava Kamma 189

Chapter 189

א כאן בגזילה קיימת כאן בשאין גזילה קיימת והא אבנט דגזילה קיימת היא מאי אבנט דמי אבנט
1 as the latter deals with a case where the misappropriated article is still intact whereas the other teaching refers to a case where the misappropriated article is no more intact. But what about the girdle [referred to above],<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Supra p. 548. ');"><sup>1</sup></span>
ב וכל היכא דגזילה קיימת לא עבוד רבנן תקנתא והרי מריש דגזילה קיימת היא ותנן על המריש הגזול שבנאו בבירה שיטול דמיו מפני תקנת השבים שאני התם דכיון דאיכא פסידא דבירה שויוה רבנן כדליתא:
2 in which case the misappropriated article was still intact? — What was meant by 'girdle' was the value of the girdle. But is it really the fact that so long as the misappropriated article was intact our Rabbis did not make this enactment?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And the actual article would have to be restored. ');"><sup>2</sup></span>
ג גזל פרה מעוברת וילדה וכו': תנו רבנן הגוזל רחל וגזזה פרה וילדה משלם אותה ואת גיזותיה ואת ולדותיה דברי רבי מאיר ר' יהודה אומר גזילה חוזרת בעיניה רבי שמעון אומר רואין אותה כאילו היא שומא אצלו בכסף
3 What then about the beam in which case the misappropriated article was still intact and we have nevertheless learnt: [R. Johanan b. Gudgada testified] that if a misappropriated beam has been built into a house, the owner will recover only its value?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Cit. V, 5; 'Ed. VII, 9' and supra p. 385. ');"><sup>3</sup></span>
ד איבעיא להו מאי טעמיה דרבי מאיר משום דקסבר שינוי במקומו עומד או דילמא בעלמא שינוי קונה והכא קנסא הוא דקא קניס
4 — That matter is different altogether, for since the house would otherwise be damaged. the Rabbis regarded the beam as being no longer intact.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And the actual beam would not have to be restored. Its value will, however, be paid on account of the fact that the beam was actually in the house. ');"><sup>4</sup></span>
ה למאי נפקא מינה להיכא דכחשא מכחש
5 IF ONE MISAPPROPRIATED A PREGNANT COW WHICH MEANWHILE GAVE BIRTH [TO A CALF] etc. Our Rabbis taught: 'He who misappropriates a sheep and shears it, or a cow which has meanwhile given birth [to a calf], has to pay for the animal and the wool and the calf;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' [The payment, that is to say, will have to be made for the combined value of the calf and wool and the improvement.] Cf. B.M. 43b. ');"><sup>5</sup></span>
ו תא שמע גזל בהמה והזקינה עבדים והזקינו משלם כשעת הגזילה רבי מאיר אומר בעבדים אומר לו הרי שלך לפניך ואילו בהמה כשעת הגזילה
6 this is the view of R. Meir. R. Judah says that the misappropriated animal will be restored intact.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' [I.e., in the state it is at the time of payment. The robber will, however, have to make up in money for the difference in the value of the cow as it stood at the time of the robbery. The difference between R. Simeon and R. Judah will be explained anon.] ');"><sup>6</sup></span>
ז ואי סלקא דעתך סבר רבי מאיר שינוי במקומו עומד אפי' בהמה נמי אלא לאו ש"מ קסבר ר' מאיר שינוי קונה והכא קנסא הוא דקא קניס
7 R. Simeon says that the animal will be considered as if it had been insured with the robber for its value [at the time of the robbery].' The question was raised: What was the reason of R. Meir? Was it because he held that a change leaves the article in its existing status?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And no ownership could thereby be transferred. ');"><sup>7</sup></span>
ח אמרי רבי מאיר לדבריהם דרבנן קאמר להו לדידי שינוי אין קונה ואפילו בהמה נמי אלא לדידכו דאמריתו שינוי קונה אודו לי מיהת בעבדא דכמקרקעי דמי וקרקע אינה נגזלת ואמרי ליה רבנן לא עבדא כמטלטלי דמי
8 Or [did he hold] in general that a change would transfer ownership, but here he imposes a fine [upon the robber], the practical difference being where the animal became leaner?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Where according to the former consideration the robber would escape further liability by restoring the animal, but according to the latter he would have to pay for the difference. ');"><sup>8</sup></span>
ט ת"ש לצבוע לו אדום וצבעו שחור שחור וצבעו אדום ר' מאיר אומר נותן לו דמי צמרו דמי צמרו אין דמי צמרו ושבחו לא ואי סלקא דעתך סבר רבי מאיר שינוי אין קונה דמי צמרו ושבחו בעי למיתב ליה
9 — Come and hear: If one misappropriated an animal and it became old, or slaves and they became old, he would still have to pay according to [their value at]<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' As the change transferred the ownership to the robber. ');"><sup>9</sup></span>
י אלא לאו ש"מ קסבר ר"מ שינוי קונה והכא קנסא הוא דקא קניס שמע מינה
10 the time of the robbery, but R. Meir said that in the case of slaves<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Who are subject to the law applicable to immovables. ');"><sup>10</sup></span>
יא איכא דאמרי הא לא איבעי לן מדאפיך רב ותני גזל פרה והזקינה עבדים והזקינו משלם כשעת הגזילה דברי רבי מאיר וחכמים אומרים בעבדים אומר לו הרי שלך לפניך ודאי לרבי מאיר שינוי קונה והכא קנסא הוא דקא קניס ליה
11 [the robber] would be entitled to say to the plaintiff: 'Here, take your own.'<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Mishnah, infra p. 561. ');"><sup>11</sup></span>
יב כי קא איבעי לן הכי איבעי לן כי קא קניס במזיד אבל בשוגג לא קניס או דילמא אפי' בשוגג נמי קניס
12 It thus appears that in the case of an animal [even R. Meir held that] the payment would have to be in accordance with [the value at] the time of the robbery.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' As the change transferred the ownership to the robber. ');"><sup>9</sup></span>
יג תא שמע חמשה גובין מן המחוררין
13 Now, if you assume that R. Meir was of the opinion that a change leaves the article in its previous status,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' And no ownership could thereby be transferred. ');"><sup>12</sup></span>
יד ואלו הן פירות ושבח פירות והמקבל עליו לזון בן אשתו ובת אשתו וגט חוב שאין בו אחריות וכתובת אשה שאין בה אחריות
14 why even in the case of an animal [can the robber not say. 'Here, take your own']? Does this therefore not prove that even R. Meir held that a change would transfer ownership, and that [in the case of the wool and the calf] it was only a fine which R. Meir imposed on the robber? — It may, however, be said that R. Meir was arguing from the premises of the Rabbis, thus: According to my view a change does not transfer ownership, so that also in the case of an animal [the robber would be entitled to say. 'Here, take your own'], but even according to your view, that a change does transfer ownership, you must at least agree with me in the case of slaves, who are compared to real property, and, as we know, real property is not subject to the law of robbery.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Cf. Suk. 30b and 32a. ');"><sup>13</sup></span>
טו מאן שמעת ליה דאמר אחריות לאו טעות סופר הוא רבי מאיר וקתני פירות ושבח פירות
15 The Rabbis, however, answered him: 'No, for slaves are on a par with movables [in this respect].'<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Cf. supra 12a. ');"><sup>14</sup></span>
טז שבח פירות היכי דמי כגון שגזל שדה מחבירו ומכרה לאחר והשביחה והרי היא יוצאה מתחת ידו כשהוא גובה
16 Come and hear: [If wool was handed over to a dyer] to dye it red but he dyed it black, or to dye it black but he dyed it red, R. Meir says that he would have to pay [the owner of the wool] for the value of the wool.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' For by acting against the instructions of the owner he rendered himself liable to the law of robbery; Mishnah infra 100b. ');"><sup>15</sup></span> [It thus appears that] he had to pay only for the original value of the wool but not for the combined value of the wool and the improvement [on account of the colour]. Now, if you suppose that R. Meir held that a change would not transfer ownership, why should he not have to pay for the combined value of the wool and the improvement? Does this therefore not prove that R. Meir held that a change would transfer ownership and that here [in the case of the calf] it was only a fine that R. Meir imposed [upon the robber]? — This could indeed be proved from it. Some even say that this question was never so much as raised; for since Rab transposed [the names in the Mishnah] and read thus: If one misappropriated a cow which became old, or slaves who became old, he would have to pay in accordance with [the value at] the time of the robbery;<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. infra p. 561. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> this is the view of R. Meir, whereas the Sages say that in the case of slaves the robber would be entitled to say, Here, take your own',<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. infra p. 561. ');"><sup>16</sup></span> it is quite certain that according to R. Meir a change would transfer ownership, and that here [in the case of a calf] it was only a fine that R. Meir imposed [upon the robber]. But if a question was raised, it was this: Was the fine imposed only in the case of wilful misappropriation whereas in the case of inadvertent misappropriation<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' As in the case of the dyer, supra p. 552. ');"><sup>17</sup></span> the fine was not imposed, or perhaps even for inadvertent misappropriation the fine was also imposed? — Come and hear: Five [kinds of creditors] are allowed to distrain only on the free assets [of the debtor];<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' But not if the landed property is already in the hands of a third party such as a purchaser and the like. ');"><sup>18</sup></span> they are as follows: [creditors for] produce,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Such as where a field full of produce was taken away in the hands of a purchaser through the fault of the vendor: the amount due to the purchaser for his loss of the actual field could be recovered even from property already in the hands of (subsequent) purchasers, whereas the amount due to him for the value of the produce he lost could be recovered only from property still in the hands of the vendor; cf. Git. V, I and B.M. 14b. ');"><sup>19</sup></span> for Amelioration showing profits,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Such as where the purchaser spent money on improving the ground which was taken away from him through the fault of the vendor. ');"><sup>20</sup></span> for an undertaking to maintain the wife's son or the wife's daughter,<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Cf. also Keth. XII, 1. ');"><sup>21</sup></span> for a bond of liability without a warranty of indemnity<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., where the particular clause making the property security was omitted in the document. V. Keth. 51b. ');"><sup>22</sup></span> and for the <i>kethubah</i> of a wife where no property is made security.<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., where the particular clause making the property security was omitted in the document. V. Keth. 51b. ');"><sup>22</sup></span> Now, what authority have you heard lay down that the omission to make the property security<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' I.e., where the particular clause making the property security was omitted in the document. V. Keth. 51b. ');"><sup>22</sup></span> is not a mere scribal error<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' But has legal consequences. ');"><sup>23</sup></span> if not R. Meir?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' V. B.M. I, 6 and ibid. 14a. ');"><sup>24</sup></span> And it is yet stated: 'Creditors for produce and Amelioration showing profits [may distrain on free assets in the hands of the debtor].' Now, who [are creditors for Amelioration showing] profits?<span class="x" onmousemove="('comment',' Lit., 'how is this possible?' ');"><sup>25</sup></span> They come in, do they not, where the vendor has misappropriated a field from his fellow and sold it to another who ameliorated it and from whose hands it was subsequently taken away. [The law then is that] when the purchaser comes to distrain